How much do you think?

[Ville]

Ok, I wanna get some perspective on this...I think I've only now realised, what has happened with my thinking. I don't remember what I was like before I got depressed, but since then, I was thinking non-stop. Constantly analysing this or that...for about nine and and a half years. I was actually afraid of stopping...

It was only last Autumn that this chaos stopped...I started doing long yoga practice daily, and so much mental crap came up that my mind finally just let go...Since then, I've had no interest in thinking...unless I have to. I find it rather peaceful that I can just be...sure, the mind conjures up thoughts passively, but the active analysation part has been reduced significantly.

So my question for you guys / gals: How much do you think? Is this passive or active, i.e. is it just the mind throwing stuff up on its own, or are you the one who creates the thoughts and decides where the analysis goes? Do you like to think actively, or just prefer to lay back and enjoy the mental peace?

[Cube]

My brain is often thinking, usually about stupid/ridiculous things. I very rarely have a break from the voices in my head discussing things with themselves.

I now probably sound insane.

[Daft]

I think at about a million miles an hour. Passively and actively, I switch on the fly. In fact I work better with distraction; it helps me concentrate. When I'm revising I try and get people to talk to me on MSN. I'd listen to music but it's not engaging enough and easy to ignore. When I'm at work, if I watch something while working I do so much more work.

I pretty much think on three levels; what's going on in front of me, what I want to think about and what's happening around me (spatially).

I also make sure I do take some time every day to just completely zone out. If I didn't I'd go insane.

[Pancake]

I have so many passive thoughts just intruding into my head. Usually about my ex, or other things which it'd do me good NOT to think about. It's annoying.

[Shorty]

I think a lot when trying to sleep.

[Shino]

I think a lot when trying to sleep.

This. I can't go to bed without radio or podcasts, to keep me away from thinking.

[Tyson]

I've got quite a few white noise tracks on my iPod to help me sleep and study. I don't particularly think it's because I think too much (snigger) but more because I've always had some background noise in my room. It was usually either a fan or an air purifier, but when I moved out I left them behind.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

I think a lot. And I mean A LOT. Constantly. Most of the time it's fine as I just think a lot of things through. It can be hard to fall asleep, but I just need a distraction like a TV show that is not too interesting and not too boring, either. My main issue arises from what is left of my autism as my thoughts have a tendency to fall into trenches and patterns - patterns that can be hard to break. They turn into something obsession-like, and they can drive me nuts as well as other things. At the moment my obsession with relationships and all that is destroying my self-confidence quite effectively. Again it helps doing other things and dragging my mind away from those thoughts. It especially helps getting out of the house as it helps my brain to stay in touch with reality and prevent my thoughts from going completely insane.

[nightwolf]

I think at about a million miles an hour. Passively and actively, I switch on the fly. In fact I work better with distraction; it helps me concentrate. When I'm revising I try and get people to talk to me on MSN. I'd listen to music but it's not engaging enough and easy to ignore. When I'm at work, if I watch something while working I do so much more work.

I pretty much think on three levels; what's going on in front of me, what I want to think about and what's happening around me (spatially).

I also make sure I do take some time every day to just completely zone out. If I didn't I'd go insane.

The best way to describe my thoughts is much the same as Daft's.

I can't write essays or do any work unless there is a lot going on, libraries are good if they are incredibly busy because it helps me to get on with things, music can be a bit more of a distraction but it has to be so loud for me to notice it and that's not good for my neighbours.

[dr4hkon]

Do you like to think actively, or just prefer to lay back and enjoy the mental peace?

No such thing as "mental peace" in my head. And I love it. There's no way I'll ever do something which might destroy the havoc that consumes my mind.

Constantly analysing this or that.

I love analysing everything. I'd like to get into some kind of "recreational psychology" (I was into "recreational mathematics" for about 2 weeks) if there's anything like this.

It's amazing how you can "read" people and I often impress myself in doing so,
But I want more. I want to analyse more, therefore I want to get into the aforementioned "recreational psychology".

[ReZourceman]

I also think.

[Tyson]

Please don't.

[Serebii]

I think, therefore I am!

[Diageo]

I never thought about how much I think before.

[Raining_again]

I've got a very observant nature, I can't switch my brain off at all. I notice EVERYTHING.

But I've got a very chilled personality so its all balanced.

[Serebii]

I've got a very observant nature, I can't switch my brain off at all. I notice EVERYTHING.

But I've got a very chilled personality so its all balanced.
I'm pretty much the same, I notice things all my friends just miss, I remember details nobody can. Sometimes, because of how my mind works, I have to fake forgetting things so that my friends don't think I'm abnormal.

Overall, I'm a very active thinker, I also tend to over-analyse every single thing.

[chairdriver]

I think alot. Sometimes too much, especially if I've just watched a good film.

[Konfucius]

Most of my thoughts come passively. Sometimes even when confronted with problems or decisions I don't actively think about them but at some point my brain sorts it out and I arrive at a (often right) conclusion. I actually like to let my mind wander. Also I have a lot of good ideas on the toilet.

[Captain Falcon]

I think... a lot.

Particularly when upset or if something is bothering me. I will analyze every little thing I can think of. Over thinking it doesn't come close. And I just make myself feel worse to the point when I struggle to control whatever emotions the thinking may be stirring.

I'm sure I know one forum member who can attest to that but even then I was holding back a bit.


I actually find though, that I'm at my best when I don't think. If I sit and think, I go round in circles and never get very far. When I just go for it, I find things a lot easier. Pretty much every piece of academic work I've ever submitted was done in two or three sits and I just put my thoughts down on paper as they come to me. I don't think about it - it pops in there and I lead with it letting it flow from one to the next.

Can't say it always worked out for the best but most of the time, it worked fairly well.

[The Bard]

I don't think very much, at least not in a very structured way. I tend to day dream a hell of a lot, which I think is probably the source of much of my oddness.

I like to think I'm pretty smart though, and that usually comes out when someone pisses me off =p.

[Frank]

I think I think a lot, if that makes any sense :p
It really depends, sometimes my mind could be over-flowing with information, but that doesn't happen very often.

Usually I'm thinking about just one thing and that becomes the center of my thoughts for usually quite a while, which eventually becomes obsessive.
Other times I have nothing going on up there when a real good song is stuck in my head and it just knocks all intelligent thoughts out of my head :p

[Coolness Bears]

eat the pudding
eat the pudding
eat the pudding
eat the pudding
eat the pudding
eat the pudding
eat the pudding
eat the pudding
eat the pudding

"Okay but then we gotta get to work"

Since the majority of my time is spent by myself, I have a lot of time to think so I think alot, none of it serious or to do with life, usually I develop new ideas for my book or think things up that even I don't want to know.

So I could be sitting here and my brain will suddenly go..."If your body was made entirely of custard..." and then it goes on from there.

[S.C.G]

I think that I think too much...

*thinks* 'yes I do think too much'

...

..

.

I know I think too much... :/


*thinks* 'I wish there was an 'Off' switch in my brain'

[Fierce_LiNk]

When I'm at work, I tend to be "in the zone" so I'm constantly thinking about where I'm standing, what I'm saying, what I need to say next, what's going on around me, and a load of other stuff. It keeps me on my toes. When I was working in a call-centre, I forced myself to forget the previous phone call, or at least put it into the back of my mind, so that I wouldn't be tired when the next one comes about.

At home, I tend to drift in between thinking a lot and thinking nothing. The moments when you can sit down and just listen to music, where you absorb the stuff without actually having to think, I like those. They're important.

I've found that I need to be thinking positive at the start of the day and at the end of the day, because otherwise I find it hard to sleep. Or, my day then tends to drag on longer, where you seem to be aware of every second that drags by. I don't like those ones. I like my days to "roll." There's a difference, at least to me anyway.

[Serebii]

Does anyone else end up thinking about about 10 things simultaneously and then, when writing it, you suddenly merge them and end up with a short story about a person who went to town for some beans but then found that he has a Fatal Exception in PHP error; Memory Over Limit 1542353476323 (tried to allocate 15 bytes) on line 214 with a large sandwich?

[Paj!]

I can't go to bed unless I'm really tired, I've realised, otherwise my thoughts keep me up. Happened the other night.

I think too much. Though it's all worth thinking about.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Does anyone else end up thinking about about 10 things simultaneously and then, when writing it, you suddenly merge them and end up with a short story about a person who went to town for some beans but then found that he has a Fatal Exception in PHP error; Memory Over Limit 1542353476323 (tried to allocate 15 bytes) on line 214 with a large sandwich?
Not exactly, but this post was very funny to read! :D

I do, however, experience, when I'm tired, that strange thoughts pop into my head for no apparent reason. Thoughts that have nothing to do with each other or with my current situation. I can't even think of a good example right now because they're so incoherent.

[Ganepark32]

The short answer to this is a lot. The slightly longer answer is that I have a very unquiet mind which runs at 100mph and means I never stop thinking. It's kept me awake in bed on several occasions for 4 or more hours and it's a nightmare lying there for that amount of time with so much running through your head.

But as a result of the excessive thinking, I suffer from random flashbacks and end up reliving them in astonishing detail. I could be thinking of the most obscure thing and my brain will still make the connection to something in my past and launch into one of many flashbacks.

[Ville]

Most of my thoughts come passively. Sometimes even when confronted with problems or decisions I don't actively think about them but at some point my brain sorts it out and I arrive at a (often right) conclusion. I actually like to let my mind wander. Also I have a lot of good ideas on the toilet.

Exactly...it's wonderful how things work out on their own. And should active thinking really be needed, e.g. to make a schedule, you can always switch it ON for a moment when necessary.

*thinks* 'I wish there was an 'Off' switch in my brain'
Actually, there is...but ironically, it cannot be activated by thinking. Rather, it happens via witnessing the thinking process for long enough and in sufficient clarity...and then the mind will just let go on its own. Permanent OFF...The easiest way to accomplish this is with regular spiritual practice, though a severe enough life crisis might trigger this as well...

In fact I work better with distraction; it helps me concentrate. When I'm revising I try and get people to talk to me on MSN. I'd listen to music but it's not engaging enough and easy to ignore. When I'm at work, if I watch something while working I do so much more work.
I can't write essays or do any work unless there is a lot going on, libraries are good if they are incredibly busy because it helps me to get on with things, music can be a bit more of a distraction but it has to be so loud for me to notice it and that's not good for my neighbours.
Hmm...interesting. When working / writing, I usually prefer silence as I like to fully concentrate on what I'm doing...constant background music just throws my focus off, be it work or leisure time. However, I've noticed the same effect with working in e.g. libraries...I tend to get more stuff done when surrounded by other people or conversing with them. Maybe it's a blend of being social and keeping the focus fresh by alternating targets...

This. I can't go to bed without radio or podcasts, to keep me away from thinking.
I've got quite a few white noise tracks on my iPod to help me sleep and study. I don't particularly think it's because I think too much (snigger) but more because I've always had some background noise in my room.
Yeah, many people report having trouble with sleeping due to excessive thoughts...now this is a sign of the mind and body trying to tell you something. For myself, such mental agitation has most often been the result of bombarding my senses all day long, e.g. by sitting in front of the computer or constantly listening to music. Not only do such non-stop activities strain the body, but they also keep the mind in an aggravated state. Without letting your mind rest and just be in silence for some moments during the day, chances are you'll end up with agitated thoughts when you go to sleep. This also means that using noise to counter such mental unrest is bound to be counter-productive in the long run...after all, you want to let the thoughts calm down, not increase the aggravation.

Naturally, (not) taking care of your body also effects how easy it is to fall asleep...

[SPAMBOT4000]

I analyse everything around me in stupid detail. I analyse why people choose to use certain words as opposed to others. And I wish it didn't ever make sense but it always does. People slip up on their word choices all the time and reveal more than they mean. I am constantly thinking about thing and it drives me insane. I wish I could switch my brain off and be ignorant for a while but i just can't.

[Emasher]

I think way to much about things possibly going wrong, and then attempt to make sure they haven't. For instance, if I go to the bank to make a withdrawal, I might check my wallet a few minutes latter to a make sure I didn't forget my card back at the machine (although, this would be impossible as the machine doesn't give you the cash until you take your card). Another example might be when I go to bed. I usually go to be a little bit latter than my family, and my computer is in a public area of the house (although, you can't see it from the door to the room, so I usually have about 15 seconds warning if someone's entering). When I leave the computer, I go through a usual routine of quitting all open applications, muting the sound, turning the monitor off, ect. However, I still find myself going back into the room a moment after leaving it to make absolute sure I didn't leave any porn open. Sometimes I'll do this even if I wasn't looking at any porn. Another example would be if I'm having a conversation with someone I don't know very well, that I want to make a good impression on. I find myself going over that conversation considering what I said, and the way the person responded for a good few minutes after the conversation was over.

This all started when I went on a school trip a few months ago and I was constantly checking my pocket to make sure my iPod, wallet, ect. were still in it. I guess I developed a habit, and it translated into my everyday life.

In general though, I'm constantly thinking. Sometimes about solving problems, and other times making up stories.

[ReZourceman]

Yeah I think too much.



About boobs.

http://img.skinnyvscurvy.com/2009/04/top-5-best-boobs-in-hollywood.jpg

[Diageo]

Yeah, many people report having trouble with sleeping due to excessive thoughts...now this is a sign of the mind and body trying to tell you something. For myself, such mental agitation has most often been the result of bombarding my senses all day long, e.g. by sitting in front of the computer or constantly listening to music. Not only do such non-stop activities strain the body, but they also keep the mind in an aggravated state. Without letting your mind rest and just be in silence for some moments during the day, chances are you'll end up with agitated thoughts when you go to sleep. This also means that using noise to counter such mental unrest is bound to be counter-productive in the long run...after all, you want to let the thoughts calm down, not increase the aggravation.

Naturally, (not) taking care of your body also effects how easy it is to fall asleep...

I do these things all the time and can fall asleep very easily. I don't think it is related.

[The fish]

My brain is often thinking, usually about stupid/ridiculous things. I very rarely have a break from the voices in my head discussing things with themselves.

I now probably sound insane.

This is me 100%, especially the insane part. The worst is when you start again, and then I expend so much mental energy on trying to get back to the state I was in before. Shut up, brain!

[Ville]

I do these things all the time and can fall asleep very easily. I don't think it is related.

Well, people are different of course...some fall asleep very easily, and some do not. Sources of agitation differ as well...Anyway, if you have trouble falling asleep due to a restless mind, it's a sign to have some breaks from whatever it is that you're doing during the day...Ignoring this with e.g. music is just a distraction, and will not solve the underlying problem...the mind's need for rest.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Well, people are different of course...some fall asleep very easily, and some do not. Sources of agitation differ as well...Anyway, if you have trouble falling asleep due to a restless mind, it's a sign to have some breaks from whatever it is that you're doing during the day...Ignoring this with e.g. music is just a distraction, and will not solve the underlying problem...the mind's need for rest.
Um, are you saying that people who have trouble falling asleep due to heavy thought activity have issues? Or what? I'm not entirely sure what you mean.

[Ville]

Um, are you saying that people who have trouble falling asleep due to heavy thought activity have issues? Or what? I'm not entirely sure what you mean.

I meant the mind is probably just overstimulated and would like some rest during the day, so it wouldn't totally erupt at night...

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

No, I meant the mind is probably just overstimulated and would need some rest during the day, so it wouldn't totally erupt at night...
Hm, I see where you're coming from, though I'm not sure if it's true. My mind works overtime whenever it gets an opportunity. It's irrelevant whether I have issues on my mind or not, my mind always finds something to occupy itself with, pointless and nonsensical as those thoughts may be.

[Guy]

I'm of the mindset that too much thinking about something usually leads to depression. Or some form of negative thought string. I overthink everything. It's annoying.

[Ville]

Hm, I see where you're coming from, though I'm not sure if it's true. My mind works overtime whenever it gets an opportunity. It's irrelevant whether I have issues on my mind or not, my mind always finds something to occupy itself with, pointless and nonsensical as those thoughts may be.

Yeah, started to wonder about overthinking when I saw your previous reply...Do you have trouble falling asleep yourself? I mean even though I suffered from neurotical thinking myself, I never had trouble with sleeping...probably had wasted all my energy thinking during the day :D

I'm of the mindset that too much thinking about something usually leads to depression. Or some form of negative thought string. I overthink everything. It's annoying.

Been there, done that...It really is annoying. Also, it's totally unnecessary...I mean life is so much easier when you just flow through it without thinking, and everything still gets done...

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Yeah, started to wonder about overthinking when I saw your previous reply...Do you have trouble falling asleep yourself? I mean even though I suffered from neurotical thinking myself, I never had trouble with sleeping...probably had wasted all my energy thinking during the day :D
Yup, I've had trouble falling asleep for many years now. When I go to bed to sleep, my thoughts keep going around. Unless I find some sort of focus that won't keep me awake, but will stop my thoughts from running amok. And while these thoughts sometimes circle around issues, they are also often simply nonsensical thoughts. I think it has a lot to do with me being autistic.

[Raining_again]

Arhghghghg i'm obsessing over something really unimportant now... its always the unimportant things i obsess over rather than the stuff thats right in front of me. >_>

[Diageo]

Don't sweat the small stuff, and it's all small stuff :)

[Ville]

Yup, I've had trouble falling asleep for many years now. When I go to bed to sleep, my thoughts keep going around. Unless I find some sort of focus that won't keep me awake, but will stop my thoughts from running amok. And while these thoughts sometimes circle around issues, they are also often simply nonsensical thoughts. I think it has a lot to do with me being autistic.

What kind of focus you do mean?

In regard to content, the mind does indeed spew out all kinds of thoughts...and non-stop. And since a neurotic mind values thinking so much, it latches almost automatically to any thought that happens to be present...

Arhghghghg i'm obsessing over something really unimportant now... its always the unimportant things i obsess over rather than the stuff thats right in front of me. >_>

Have either of you ever tried meditation? Find a comfy position sitting or lying down and just let the mind be...letting go of thoughts and active thinking, even for just a moment...

[Diageo]

If I try not to think, I just think about not thinking.

[Raining_again]

If I try not to think, I just think about not thinking.

hahah oh this is so true.

My mind races, its always on and i've never found a way to turn it off. I'm not often stressed but when I do stress its about really petty things that shouldn't matter and the stuff that does is just like.....-shrug-

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

What kind of focus you do mean?

In regard to content, the mind does indeed spew out all kinds of thoughts...and non-stop. And since a neurotic mind values thinking so much, it latches almost automatically to any thought that happens to be present...



Have either of you ever tried meditation? Find a comfy position sitting or lying down and just let the mind be...letting go of thoughts and active thinking, even for just a moment...
The focus could be a programme on TV, a topic for my thoughts etc. The point is it should neither be too boring nor interesting.

I have never tried meditation. I don't think I'm able to stop thinking. :hmm:

[Tissue Town]

As a healthy and concious human being, I think constantly. As long as my brain functions, constant thought goes through my mind.

[Frank]

Watch something silly on TV like Big Brother for example and your mind will slowly drift to the unconscious mind...

Or just watch Comedy Rainbow and your thinking process will slow down :p Sorry, ReZ jokes seem to be popular around here and I wanted in on the action :laughing:

[MadDog]

Or just watch Comedy Rainbow and your thinking process will slow down :p Sorry, ReZ jokes seem to be popular around here and I wanted in on the action :laughing:

Don't worry about it.

He'll thank you later for it.

[EEVILMURRAY]

One thinks alot. I go from passive to active, pr0 style. One leads into the other. I can be walking somewhere, thoughts dancing around then a thought catches or something prompts a thought which then warrants proper consideration. Maybe even physical exertion. An example of this is last night doing a pub quiz, a question was "What game has its name derived from the Persian for 'King'?" The answer was chess but beforehand was just thinking of games which had random names. Buckaroo came to mind. Jokingly I asked the Quiz Baron was that it and naturally he said no. But now we both got thinking about the origin of the name.
Does anyone else end up thinking about about 10 things simultaneously and then, when writing it, you suddenly merge them and end up with a short story about a person who went to town for some beans but then found that he has a Fatal Exception in PHP error; Memory Over Limit 1542353476323 (tried to allocate 15 bytes) on line 214 with a large sandwich?
Never.

Although it might be worth a go.

[Ville]

I have never tried meditation. I don't think I'm able to stop thinking. :hmm:

Heh, first lesson: don't believe everything your mind says...It lies a LOT, but you can't see this until you take a step back first...which just takes practice. If you have spent your life thinking nonstop, you cannot expect to detach from it in an instant either...but gradually, it sure is possible.

Again, there's a difference between active and passive thinking. Even if you stop thinking (active), the mind will continue to push out random thoughts (passive). This is completely normal...All you need to do is just witness and let go, again and again...

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Heh, first lesson: don't believe everything your mind says...It lies a LOT, but you can't see this until you take a step back first...which just takes practice. If you have spent your life thinking nonstop, you cannot expect to detach from it in an instant either...but gradually, it sure is possible.

Again, there's a difference between active and passive thinking. Even if you stop thinking (active), the mind will continue to push out random thoughts (passive). This is completely normal...All you need to do is just witness and let go, again and again...
Haha! Trust me, I know! My brain has tried countless times and continues to try to fool me. :heh:

Well, when I try to sleep, I'd say my thinking is primarily passive. What you're saying I should practice is just letting these thoughts happen without thinking actively about them?

[EEVILMURRAY]

Do you go to your cave and meet your power animal?


Slide?

[Ville]

Haha! Trust me, I know! My brain has tried countless times and continues to try to fool me. :heh:

Yeah, it can be a very clever bugger...

Well, when I try to sleep, I'd say my thinking is primarily passive. What you're saying I should practice is just letting these thoughts happen without thinking actively about them?

Yep, just witness...You can also do this anytime during daily life, like walking or eating etc.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Yep, just witness...You can also do this anytime during daily life, like walking or eating etc.
So is this the main point of meditation? Not to stop thinking, but to just let the thoughts happen and pass?

[Diageo]

How does your mind lie to you? You must have an evil mind, mine makes mistakes but doesn't lie to me. I'd notice if it was, it's my mind.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

How does your mind lie to you? You must have an evil mind, mine makes mistakes but doesn't lie to me. I'd notice if it was, it's my mind.
None of those terms are accurate. Don't take them literally. But it's easy to get fooled by your mind. From something as simple as optical illusions to something as intricate as your perception of yourself, your brain can easily become convinced of something you know isn't true.

[Diageo]

Like what?

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Like what?
Like confidence. A person's confidence is easily influenced way too much in either direction.

[Diageo]

I don't see how that is your mind fooling you.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

I don't see how that is your mind fooling you.
Because you're convinced of something that's not actually true. You might even be able to see that it's untrue if you think rationally, but you still feel like it's true because the part of your brain believing it's true is not the rational part of your brain. Without knowing much about how the brain works, I think it's the emotional part of your brain that is easily fooled.

I suck at explaining this, and there are probably better examples, but the point still stands.

[Ellmeister]

You walk into a room and this girl looks at you, your brain tells you that she's has made eye contact with you because she likes you. Instead she hasn't its simply that your eyes met. Your brain tells you she's into you when really she isn't. If you thought rationally you'd probably realise that it was just a coincidence, but your brain has said "Mate you look damn good, of course that lass fancies you!"


Something like that D-boy?

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

You walk into a room and this girl looks at you, your brain tells you that she's has made eye contact with you because she likes you. Instead she hasn't its simply that your eyes met. Your brain tells you she's into you when really she isn't. If you thought rationally you'd probably realise that it was just a coincidence, but your brain has said "Mate you look damn good, of course that lass fancies you!"


Something like that D-boy?
Exactly. And it works the other way as well, where you dismiss a girl who's obviously coming on to you because your self-esteem is low and you think: "I'm a total loser, of course she's not coming on to me."

[Frank]

I'll try my best at explaining it as I think this is a good example.
So, it's not that you're mind is a seperate entity altogether and planning evil stuff behind your back. In a way, it's being fooled along with you.

For example, if you know any 2 year olds or just any child really, you could show them the colour/shade of white and tell them that it's called black. Most probable outcome is that they'll believe you and think white is black and hence, their mind is almost 'lieing' to them.

I hope that made sense and I worded it properly :p
I think you hit the nail on the head Ellmeister too.

[Diageo]

Just seems like you are making a mistake yourself, a quick decision, but when you think about it further you realise you made the mistake. All you, all one.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Just seems like you are making a mistake yourself, a quick decision, but when you think about it further you realise you made the mistake. All you, all one.
You may think so, but that's not the case. What you describe is making an assumption, finding out it's wrong and then correcting yourself. The point is that when your mind tricks you, even though you figure out it's wrong, it still continues to convince you it's right.

I don't think I can really explain it any better than this.

[Ganepark32]

Your mind doesn't lie to you. It all comes down to your own perception of the people and world around you, something which is built up and reinforced from a young age. Being unable to differentiate between say a girl meeting your gaze and a girl who is genuinely interested in you isn't your mind lying. It's confused at the perceived emotion that it is taking in through the senses and for whatever reason through your development as a person or through the limitations of our own abilities, the ability to differentiate between differing emotions or looks results in an active decision that someone is perhaps interested or not when it isn't the case. It's an active thinking process that we actively go after with the decision coming from us and not from our brain, in the sense that the brain would give the answer only in a passive instance and even then a passive instance would simply imply innate characteristics such as survival instincts.

A perfect example of this actually comes from some of the work one of my lecturers has done on eye movement and perception. Basically, you see a mask, plain white on both the exterior and interior, and it's slowly rotated round either clockwise or anti-clockwise. We see the mask normally and then when the back is shown, through the limitations of our abilities as a person to perceive objects we see the concave area of the mask as being convex (in other words, the interior protrudes outwards like the exterior). Think I explained that correctly. It's better to see it working. I'll see if I can find a video of it.

edit: found it :D

QbKw0_v2clo

[Ville]

Nice video Ganepark...

Yeah, "making mistakes" is a more accurate expression...The mind is more like an advisor that keeps giving you all kinds of views and opinions...many of which are totally skewed. "Can you do this? What do other people think? You sure this is not too heavy for you? Might get pretty stressful, if you do it that often...You have to rest as well, right?" etc etc.

The point is that when your mind tricks you, even though you figure out it's wrong, it still continues to convince you it's right.

Yeah, you can get darn tangled up trying to figure out which statement holds true or not...resulting in never-ending analysing and inner turmoil. However, when your consciousness understands through experience that the passive thinking mind has a tendency to be totally wrong, thoughts will have suddenly have much less power over you. Instead of trying to analyse every conflicting statement in order to verify its truthfulness, you don't need to anymore...you can just let go.

So is this the main point of meditation? Not to stop thinking, but to just let the thoughts happen and pass?

Yes, passive thoughts will pop up whether you want it or not...So just witness, letting them come and go without getting involved...And should you catch yourself thinking at some point, just note and go back to observing...

Basically, this type of work is the basis for any kind of spiritual practice...can be called awareness or mindfulness etc. There are a lot of different meditation types, like concentrating on a single object, though in order to do this, you'll need to be able to let go of thoughts...Still, "meditation" is a bit loaded word...could just call it "inner silence" as well.

[Diageo]

I understand what Ganepark said, but I don't think what Ville says is the same. I'll have a better look at it when I can get to a proper computer.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

I think we're all pretty much trying to explain the same thing. But I'm no expert on the subject, just speaking from experience.

[Diageo]

All I know is that I never feel like there's in any way two
Mentalities in my head. Always one that thinks for everything.

[Ville]

All I know is that I never feel like there's in any way two
Mentalities in my head. Always one that thinks for everything.

Ok. It's easier to make the disctinction, when you try to be silent and not actively think for a while...

If I try not to think, I just think about not thinking.

Just note and let go, again and again...don't force it, just witness gently...

[uəʌəsʎɐɾ]

I've just skim-read this topic - even though it's probably one right up my street.

- Meditation.

When I close my eyes, I am immediately aware of my inner voice, streaming chatter and troubles and nonsense. At the same time my visual cortex is wildly active, summoning abstract images that it detects from the back of my eyelids. For me, sleepless nights stem from too much noise - my dreams are mostly visual and audibly numb. This may be due to my deafness, maybe a link to a part of my life before hearing aids meant that reality had a listenable quantity...

I try to concentrate on the images, but not in a way where I attempt to maintain a vision, rather I 'label' what I see and let it shift and move on, move through the detritus. What I actually consider 'meditation' is where I try to actually form an image; say, I keep seeing faces in the void, I try and grab one and hold it there. I try to steer my thoughts into constructing something that I tell it to construct, rather than just being a passenger. Slowly the inner-voice silences, and I am left with interpretable images that I can later ponder on, or describe.

- Lying

Your eyesight accounts for roughly 90% of your sensual input. Personally, my eyesight is borderline 50%-decent, and as such I cannot actually trust what I see completely. Combined with my sense of hearing, there is a legitimate source to my infrequent paranoid thoughts and feelings. If I cannot trust what my own interpretation of reality is saying, then how can I understand what is really happening?

With this in mind, I can understand far more easily the constraints of the mind, and the misinterpretations that can occur. I think this had led me, perversely, to be more understanding, my allocating the energy to follow up more than one possible 'reality' that I am experiencing.

On the whole, this applies to social dynamics. If I am in a noisy, dark pub with friends I have to go by body language and pitch changes to determine what is being discussed. My brain automatically assumes that certain sounds mean certain words, when in actuality I am not hearing the words audibly formed as a whole. This leads to over-thinking and over-analysis of my situation, and puts a fair bit of strain on communication for me...

... And this is where i lose trail of my thoughts.

I think too much. I have to emphasise in order to understand what is going on, which is rather autistic, and hard to cope with when my mind is not actually organised in an autistic way. I rely on others to determine my reality because my own senses are not to be trusted, and as such there is a constant battle going on inside my head.

Like my sensory deprivation, these are conditions that are not readily observable, and as such it is incredibly difficult to exist in a world where most people take their reality to be all that they can see, and yet I exist as an individual within their reality who readily defies their expectations. Once people get to know me they have to accept my alternate view of reality, and thus have to question their own. For me, this weeds out those who can think deep and those who cannot, and the survivors are those that, I guess, get to be my friends.

But having my friendships based upon such a twisted scheme of logic is rather stressful, and leads to whole chapters of mental chatter. TBC?

[Raining_again]

Nice contribution j7, what a fascinating read :)

[Jimbob]

Very interesting there J7.

I happen to think all the time, and it does vary on what subject(s) i can come-up with. Most of my thinking does occur around this sort of time at night. Usually thinking on what the next day plans are, of which i have no interest or ever get around to doing. Sometimes, i can come up with an answer to a question asked several hours earlier from something i think of spontaneously, usually it doesn't have anything to do with the question that was asked.

[Raining_again]

I watched the docu thing on about the twin towers disaster. Actually watching the whole thing ripped my heart out. Seeing people jump out of the buildings in terror.. so sad. Morbidly fascinating but felt sick at the thought of hundreds of people being instantly killed when the building collapsed.

Never thought about it really until I watched the documentary. :(