Tickets Touts

[thirtynine.]

Hi,
Today i woke up at 8:30 so i could buy tickets to see the yeah yeah yeah's, which were released at 9:00. I like them alot. I actually buy their music. By like 9:05 they were all sold out, and sever fail ment i didnt get one. Now i look on ebay and see THIS (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/YEAH-YEAH-YEAHS-Standing-tickets-SHEPHERDS-BUSH-EMPIRE_W0QQitemZ310125645498QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_ Tickets_Tickets_LE?hash=item310125645498&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1229|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A13 18)
Seriously? 50 quid. They were only like 18. This bellend bought tickets. Which i could have had, specificity to put them on ebay straight away, hes not even doing it right and waiting till closer to the even so the price rises. Not only is he a scumbag but hes also a n00b.
FAIL. Touts are fail.

[Daft]

Yeah, they're a bunch of tossers.

[uəʌəsʎɐɾ]

Much hatred for them. But what are the ways around it?

Y' could have forced-pick-up at venue, but just with a code? can be texted. Maybe send tickets out so they arrive the day before/day of a gig? Unfair if the post goes wrong.

Perhaps ticket sites operate like facebook, then police and shut down offenders? Or last... some form of ID verification at purchase and venue.

Kinda reminds me of train tickets. You either book waaay in advance, or suddenly if you travel on the day you have to pay a crapload more money for a ticket that they sell to you even if they know there are no seats on the train left as they've all been reserved. BAH! STUFF! BAD!

[Charlie]

Nah, he's actually doing it properly. Selling them straight away you know you're going to make money, tickets quite often go for less right before the concert because they're desperately trying to get rid of them.

But yeah, it's annoying that people do this. But you should still be allowed to sell them in case something comes up and you can't actually make the gig.

[Jimbob]

Ticket touts annoy me, they cost the artists money this way. The tickets i bought for Bon Jovi back this time last year cost me £50 each from Ticketmaster. Ebay sellers were selling them for £150-£200 per ticket, same as the ones i had.

And these touts were even selling them outside and inside the stadium for same prices, but for lesser tickets.

In some ways, jayseven is right with the way the tickets are issued, mine came 4 days before the event but the money was taken the day i bought them.

Edit: Ok, i read the above by Charlie and that way works as well in the event of not being able to go to the gig.

[EEVILMURRAY]

Ticket touts annoy me, they cost the artists money this way.
How do you figure? The artist charges a set amount of money for people to see them. People pay money to see them. The artist gets the money.

The fact that some fans pay more doesn't really matter.

[ReZourceman]

Aye, bit of money on the side, I couldn't really afford anything without toutting tbh.

[Sheikah]

Hi,
Today i woke up at 8:30 so i could buy tickets to see the yeah yeah yeah's, which were released at 9:00. I like them alot. I actually buy their music. By like 9:05 they were all sold out, and sever fail ment i didnt get one. Now i look on ebay and see THIS (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/YEAH-YEAH-YEAHS-Standing-tickets-SHEPHERDS-BUSH-EMPIRE_W0QQitemZ310125645498QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_ Tickets_Tickets_LE?hash=item310125645498&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1229%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C 240%3A1318)
Seriously? 50 quid. They were only like 18. This bellend bought tickets. Which i could have had, specificity to put them on ebay straight away, hes not even doing it right and waiting till closer to the even so the price rises. Not only is he a scumbag but hes also a n00b.
FAIL. Touts are fail.

It should be illegal. If people buy them and something comes up then they should be the one to take the hit, otherwise people can just carry on selling them and making a stupid profit.

We can only hope that there is some balancing force in the universe that causes these people to die alone, painfully, and soon.

[Dannyboy-the-Dane]

Supply and demand, I'm afraid. VERY powerful forces ...

[Ramar]

What I also hate is that you can now sell concert tickets on Play.com.

What a load of shit, I had a similar story a way back and missed out on tickets for The Killers (ticketmaster queued me for 15 mins then told me they were sold out). Went on Play.com to buy some stuff and saw that bastards were selling tickets on there for £200!!

Touts are wankers, but the only way around them is to put a name on each ticket and then have ID at the door to prove you bought them. But the hassle for door staff would probably be too much.

[MoogleViper]

What about people who have genuine reasons for selling tickets? God knows I don't want to be stuck with tickets to a gig I can't go to. Not everybody is a rip-off merchant out to scam people.

Besides if people are willing to pay £200 for some £30 tickets then that's their own stupid fault.

[nightwolf]

This is why on some websites them limit the person to a number of a tickets. I believe for download etc your only allowed a limited number. I'm pretty sure you could only buy 4 or something when I last saw rise against.

Unfortunatly it'll never get rid of them completely, but it should be enforced so much more than it is.

[Kirkatronics]

Hi,
Today i woke up at 8:30 so i could buy tickets to see the yeah yeah yeah's, which were released at 9:00. I like them alot. I actually buy their music. By like 9:05 they were all sold out, and sever fail ment i didnt get one. Now i look on ebay and see THIS (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/YEAH-YEAH-YEAHS-Standing-tickets-SHEPHERDS-BUSH-EMPIRE_W0QQitemZ310125645498QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_ Tickets_Tickets_LE?hash=item310125645498&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1229%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C 240%3A1318)
Seriously? 50 quid. They were only like 18. This bellend bought tickets. Which i could have had, specificity to put them on ebay straight away, hes not even doing it right and waiting till closer to the even so the price rises. Not only is he a scumbag but hes also a n00b.
FAIL. Touts are fail.
They sell them straight away because people panic buy, towards the event he touts try shift em.
Supply and demand, I'm afraid. VERY powerful forces ...Thats it =]

Yeah, they're a bunch of tossers.
Why?
Isnt this what the ticket offices do anyway?
It might annoy you, but its only like anything else.
The ticket offices buy them, and sell them for a profit.

[DuD]

Pisses me off when it happens to me, but its a fact of life.
Supply and demand, I'm afraid. VERY powerful forces ...Bang on the money there.

[uəʌəsʎɐɾ]

This is why on some websites them limit the person to a number of a tickets. I believe for download etc your only allowed a limited number. I'm pretty sure you could only buy 4 or something when I last saw rise against.

Unfortunatly it'll never get rid of them completely, but it should be enforced so much more than it is.

Aye, I can't remember the last time you could buy more than 4 anywhere. iirc even box offices are limiting how many an individual can buy. I remember when I queued up from 3am with a mate outside a box office in brighton the night before the green day tickets came out. We were 3rd/4th in line! We were buying like 6 tickets each...

[Sheikah]

Why?
Isnt this what the ticket offices do anyway?
It might annoy you, but its only like anything else.
The ticket offices buy them, and sell them for a profit.
Why? I'm not sure if you're taking the piss or not...

So basically, from what I can gather, you're saying it's fine for people to increase the price further because the original company are making a profit? How dare a company make profit! Everyone knows it's unacceptable to make anything other than a loss.

But yeah, people buying them to sell for loads do nothing other than click 'buy' then 'sell', the lowlife scroungers. And let's face it, a lot of them probably are.

[Kirkatronics]

Why? I'm not sure if you're taking the piss or not...

So basically, from what I can gather, you're saying it's fine for people to increase the price further because the original company are making a profit? How dare a company make profit! Everyone knows it's unacceptable to make anything other than a loss.

But yeah, people buying them to sell for loads do nothing other than clic`k 'buy' then 'sell', the lowlife scroungers. And let's face it, a lot of them probably are.No, what im saying is i see nothing wrong with making a profit. If they fiond a system to make profit its all ok by me...

[Sheikah]

No, what im saying is i see nothing wrong with making a profit. If they fiond a system to make profit its all ok by me...
Digging up human remains and selling on organs. That actually happens, so are you ok with that?

[fex]

Touts are the Scum of the Universe.

Tickets should be printed with some kind of ID of them. There is no way someone should pay x2 as much for a gig. Plus I HIGHLY doubt touts declare this as a second income, therefore I'm surprised the government hasn't made an effort to try and correct this.

Glasto has is spot on.

What about people who have genuine reasons for selling tickets? God knows I don't want to be stuck with tickets to a gig I can't go to. Not everybody is a rip-off merchant out to scam people.


If people can't go then they should sell their tickets on at the original value. I've bought tickets for a gig I couldn't make, I sold the tickets on eBay at the price that I paid for them.

[Molly]

Mr brother had two extra tickets to the NFL game at Wembley so he sold them to his friends but charged them at least £20 extra for the privilege. I thought it was absolutely disgusting. His response was ''credit crunch''.

[Kirkatronics]

Digging up human remains and selling on organs. That actually happens, so are you ok with that?
Thats illegal though, its also a completly different circumstance.
Tickets have no emotional value added to them untill you actually get them.

[MoogleViper]

If people can't go then they should sell their tickets on at the original value. I've bought tickets for a gig I couldn't make, I sold the tickets on eBay at the price that I paid for them.

I'm not disputing that. But people are talking about photo ID and not being able to sell tickets on at all.

[Platty]

I too was trying to get Yeah yeah yeahs tickets on friday morning. I failed to get saturday standing (what I wanted) but ended up with sunday level 1 unreserved seating/standing.......

I checked out ebay and saw loads on there for double the asking price. Unfortunately thats the way it is these days. There is a lot of money to be made in selling gig tickets. It annoys the hell out of me but how do you stop it completely?

Arctic Monkeys are pretty hardcore against the touts. To get tickets to a lot of their gigs you have to sign up to their website and when tickets go on sale you get a special link and then you can only buy 2 tickets. The tickets dont get sent to you but instead you take your confirmation number and card you booked with and in you go. Fucks touts up.

This website is the best to use to buy tickets for sold out events:

http://www.scarletmist.com

People sell tickets on there for gigs they can no longer make and they have to sell at face value.

I've got a couple of tickets from there before. Only thing is it's up to you to arrange the exchange, I always do it in person as its easier. It's a good site and a good way to beat the touts. Fans selling to fans rather than arseholes trying to make many selling to fans.

[EEVILMURRAY]

You should all be angry at the artists themselves. How dare they charge you money to listen to their music.

[uəʌəsʎɐɾ]

Another way to solve the whole but-what-if-I-can't-go,-I-should-be-able-to-try-and-get-my-money-back thing; if you buy online you shouldn't be charged until the day of the event, or maybe you actually pay for it once you are inside the venue. That way if you don't go, you don't lose out.

[Ellmeister]

I wasted £18 on a ticket yesterday that I couldn't go to! Oh well, prices are prices I suppose, never been to a tout and hopefully never shall.

[Kirkatronics]

Another way to solve the whole but-what-if-I-can't-go,-I-should-be-able-to-try-and-get-my-money-back thing; if you buy online you shouldn't be charged until the day of the event, or maybe you actually pay for it once you are inside the venue. That way if you don't go, you don't lose out.
That would be a loss of a sale for te vendors, though.
Its not really fair that they have to waste a ticket beause of your bad planning.

[EEVILMURRAY]

Another way to solve the whole but-what-if-I-can't-go,-I-should-be-able-to-try-and-get-my-money-back thing; if you buy online you shouldn't be charged until the day of the event, or maybe you actually pay for it once you are inside the venue. That way if you don't go, you don't lose out.
So there could be an unlimited number to buy/basically reserve online? That's shitty on account it'd create a massive backlog, someone books the day off work [and more things scheduled, hotel etc.] to get there ready to pay and find it's too full, because enough online reservers got there first?

[Platty]

No no, same amount of tickets available but you just dont pay till you get into the venue. Touts wont buy any cos they don't want to go into the venue.

If you cant make it you could inform the venue and then "returns" will be able to buy on the door. No one loses out and the touts fail.

[Sheikah]

Thats illegal though, its also a completly different circumstance.

Um, you said you had no problem with people making profit, when clearly there are several ways of making profit that aren't acceptable. Touts should be banned too and all eBay sales removed (except those selling tickets at retail price). The Arctic Monkeys procedure sounds great - they should adopt that for all gigs.

[Kirkatronics]

Um, you said you had no problem with people making profit, when clearly there are several ways of making profit that aren't acceptable. Touts should be banned too and all eBay sales removed (except those selling tickets at retail price).
Theres a difference between illegal methods, and legal ones.
I see nothing wrong with tickets being sold on, as they arent stolen, to make a profit.
Its how business works, buy low, make maximum profit.
The touts only work because people are willing to pay the prices they charge.

[uəʌəsʎɐɾ]

But touts are taking advantage of our emotions! When it comes to your favourite artists, desperation takes over! You need to see these artists, no matter what.

Of course there's a difference between illegal and legal. The Law. Buying low and making as much profit as possible is usually done through bulk buying at discounted prices; cutting overheads, increasing a product's status and NOT by acquiring all or most of the resource and bottle-necking access to it, charging whatever price they like because they know people want it.

If shops did this with your food, you would starve. If the utility companies did it with our fuel and water, we would freeze. The difference here is that gigs are a veblen good, but it is still a rodenty, low-life occupation that closely resembles racketeering, which is against the law.

There is something wrong with selling them on to make a higher profit. It is, simply, that they are reducing the freedom of others - the freedom to buy a ticket to a gig at retail price. Morally, it is wrong.

It's like... you've been saving up your pennies to buy this puppy. Some old pensioner's seen you fawning at the shop window every day for a month at this puppy. One day they see you walking down the road looking all happy, armed with bags of coppers - they don't see the potential happiness about to occur - oh no! They see an economical opportunity to make some easy money. They pop into the shop, buy the pup, and upon seeing your sad face they say "I'll sell you this pup for twice what you were gonna pay."

Et cetera, et cetera. It's just not nice, not necessary, and causes annoyance and hatred.

[Kirkatronics]

But touts are taking advantage of our emotions! When it comes to your favourite artists, desperation takes over! You need to see these artists, no matter what.

Of course there's a difference between illegal and legal. The Law. Buying low and making as much profit as possible is usually done through bulk buying at discounted prices; cutting overheads, increasing a product's status and NOT by acquiring all or most of the resource and bottle-necking access to it, charging whatever price they like because they know people want it.

If shops did this with your food, you would starve. If the utility companies did it with our fuel and water, we would freeze. The difference here is that gigs are a veblen good, but it is still a rodenty, low-life occupation that closely resembles racketeering, which is against the law.

There is something wrong with selling them on to make a higher profit. It is, simply, that they are reducing the freedom of others - the freedom to buy a ticket to a gig at retail price. Morally, it is wrong.

It's like... you've been saving up your pennies to buy this puppy. Some old pensioner's seen you fawning at the shop window every day for a month at this puppy. One day they see you walking down the road looking all happy, armed with bags of coppers - they don't see the potential happiness about to occur - oh no! They see an economical opportunity to make some easy money. They pop into the shop, buy the pup, and upon seeing your sad face they say "I'll sell you this pup for twice what you were gonna pay."

Et cetera, et cetera. It's just not nice, not necessary, and causes annoyance and hatred.
You cant really use the shops, or fuel companies as examples, we NEED those things to survive.
You dont NEED to see the artists play, you want to.
Im not saying its morally right, im just saying i wouldn hesitate to do it if i got the chance.

[uəʌəsʎɐɾ]

Hey mister, I commented on teh distinction between need and want.

I was going to use a puppy as an example, or a cornetto or something. Yes, it is a choice to see a gig, but can you not see how it is unfair when the only choice you have is to pay double the price, when the tout could choose to pay the regular price? How is that equal, how is that fair? It is not.

With businesses there is a win/win situation between a customer and a supplier. You are willing to pay an inflated price on a good because you are unable to attain the good directly, without the middleman.

Bah! No point. Thankfully we operate in a society where we don't accept anyone and everyone. If you choose knowingly to do something you know isn't liked, then that's your choice. I choose to not respect you for it.

[Sheikah]

Theres a difference between illegal methods
The only difference in this case regarding legal and illegal methods is that it hasn't been outlawed yet. :p

Im not saying its morally right, im just saying i wouldn hesitate to do it if i got the chance.

This is the mentality that needs to be eradicated. People are so damn greedy and selfish; it's unreal.

[Kirkatronics]

Hey mister, I commented on teh distinction between need and want.

I was going to use a puppy as an example, or a cornetto or something. Yes, it is a choice to see a gig, but can you not see how it is unfair when the only choice you have is to pay double the price, when the tout could choose to pay the regular price? How is that equal, how is that fair? It is not.

With businesses there is a win/win situation between a customer and a supplier. You are willing to pay an inflated price on a good because you are unable to attain the good directly, without the middleman.

Bah! No point. Thankfully we operate in a society where we don't accept anyone and everyone. If you choose knowingly to do something you know isn't liked, then that's your choice. I choose to not respect you for it.I do have a point, but i cant get it across without sounding arrogant, so ill let you guys win.
One question, though.
Would you do it if you had the oppertunity?

[Dyson]

Obviously not everyone does WAC, hence the website scarletmist.com running (or whatever it was called).

[uəʌəsʎɐɾ]

Your point is that on an economical level, it is entirely acceptable; you suggest that the tickets may as well be auctioned off in the first place, allowing the supply/demand to truly set the price of the good in the first place.

I'm saying that society has such a skewed income distribution, leading with this method would ultimately mean only those rich enough will be able to afford gigs.

Your other point is that money is good. More money = better. I want more money, ergo: this shit is cool. My argument is that you wouldn't feel the same if you knew the person you were selling to. Would you buy a ticket for a gig you don't want to go to, then sell it at double the price to your best friend? Your girlfriend? Your mother?

There's a point where you gotta stop looking at how the gig or the ticket is valued, but at how you value money. Fuck the money, I say. There's always more of it.

[Kirkatronics]

Your point is that on an economical level, it is entirely acceptable; you suggest that the tickets may as well be auctioned off in the first place, allowing the supply/demand to truly set the price of the good in the first place.

I'm saying that society has such a skewed income distribution, leading with this method would ultimately mean only those rich enough will be able to afford gigs.

Your other point is that money is good. More money = better. I want more money, ergo: this shit is cool. My argument is that you wouldn't feel the same if you knew the person you were selling to. Would you buy a ticket for a gig you don't want to go to, then sell it at double the price to your best friend? Your girlfriend? Your mother?

There's a point where you gotta stop looking at how the gig or the ticket is valued, but at how you value money. Fuck the money, I say. There's always more of it.
Yea, i wouldnt do it to frieands or family.

[EEVILMURRAY]

No no, same amount of tickets available but you just dont pay till you get into the venue. Touts wont buy any cos they don't want to go into the venue.

If you cant make it you could inform the venue and then "returns" will be able to buy on the door. No one loses out and the touts fail.
May stop the touts but might lose the artists money, if there aren't many sad enough people hanging round the arena/stadium/etc.

[Fierce_LiNk]

Going back to the original point:

Hi,
Today i woke up at 8:30 so i could buy tickets to see the yeah yeah yeah's, which were released at 9:00. I like them alot. I actually buy their music. By like 9:05 they were all sold out, and sever fail ment i didnt get one. Now i look on ebay and see THIS (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/YEAH-YEAH-YEAHS-Standing-tickets-SHEPHERDS-BUSH-EMPIRE_W0QQitemZ310125645498QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_ Tickets_Tickets_LE?hash=item310125645498&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1229|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A13 18)
Seriously? 50 quid. They were only like 18. This bellend bought tickets. Which i could have had, specificity to put them on ebay straight away, hes not even doing it right and waiting till closer to the even so the price rises. Not only is he a scumbag but hes also a n00b.
FAIL. Touts are fail.

Pretty much the reason why I hardly go to gigs. I find it difficult to get tickets, mainly because many sell out so quickly. Then, I get annoyed when I see people inflating the prices on ebay. It's greed, really. But, the only way to get these people where it hurts is to not buy these tickets. If they can put these tickets on sites, charge and obscene amount, and then see them sell for that amount, then of course they're just going to do it again and again. Actually, can ebay do anything about this? Maybe stopping people selling tickets for four times the asking price, that'd be a nice start.

I dunno, I never use Ebay.

[Jav_NE]

Two tickets should be the limit. I would say one, but then you could never buy gig tickets as a suprise for someone. Two seems right. There's no need for any more. If more people are joing your party then they should get their own ticket and stop being so god damn lazy. ID's would never work for anything other than major festivals. Too much hassle.

I dont like touts, but at the same time, they are clever people. They take a risk too. They buy a bunch of tickets and might not be able to sell them, so they make a loss. Of course, if people buy them, thehn they're laughing. The only other way to stop them is to encourage people not to buy them at the inflated prices. But they will. Because they want to see whoever it is so damn bad. C'est la vie i guess.

I dont mind touts on the street though. If they are selling legit tickets, it can be a good way to get in last minute, even if it does cost you a bomb. At the end of the day, artists you want to see dont usually tour that often. You get one chance in a year, sometimes more, to see them. So you pay up.

[Kirkatronics]

Two tickets should be the limit. I would say one, but then you could never buy gig tickets as a suprise for someone. Two seems right. There's no need for any more. If more people are joing your party then they should get their own ticket and stop being so god damn lazy. ID's would never work for anything other than major festivals. Too much hassle.

I dont like touts, but at the same time, they are clever people. They take a risk too. They buy a bunch of tickets and might not be able to sell them, so they make a loss. Of course, if people buy them, thehn they're laughing. The only other way to stop them is to encourage people not to buy them at the inflated prices. But they will. Because they want to see whoever it is so damn bad. C'est la vie i guess.

I dont mind touts on the street though. If they are selling legit tickets, it can be a good way to get in last minute, even if it does cost you a bomb. At the end of the day, artists you want to see dont usually tour that often. You get one chance in a year, sometimes more, to see them. So you pay up.
Theres not really 100% mothods of keeping everyone happy, limits make real groups of friends lose out, IDs prevent suprises, and paying once you get there gives a problem they may not be sold.