What would it be like if RARE had not left Nintendo?

[welsh_gamer]

With all these rumours about Goldeneye possibly appearing on the Xbox 360, it got me thinking about what it would be like now on the Wii if RARE had not left Nintendo.

Would we have seen a few early Rare N64 titles on the VC from day one?

Would we have gotten something as a launch title? Perfect Dark, Viva Pinata or would Rare have just given us a mini-game collection perhaps? Conker's Bad Fur Day with Wii-controls and as the console's first online game would have been pretty cool methinks.

Characters such as Banjo Kazooie and Conker may be appearing in Smash Brothers Brawl. :awesome:

What games would you like to have seen?

What do you think? Do you still like Rare, or don't care much about them nowadays? I was a huge fan of them and would probably play every game they released on the Wii if it happened. One can dream....

[Hero-of-Time]

Personally I would be happy with having RAREs N64 games on the VC. I would kill for the chance to play Jet Force Gemini again!

*cocks shotgun*

[mcj metroid]

Well rare were only good during the n64 era...The only advantage would be having the rights to franchises such as conker or banjo otherwise NIntendo made the right choice..

Free radical were the best part of rare and they had already left. Microsoft offered a ridiculous sum for them and Nintendo ran with it(i mean they were working on donkey kong racing at the time?= yamn)

Then microsoft got them for xbox and they created i think one game for it.. grabbed by the ghoulies.. Sold shit.

in the end it would have made no difference.. Nintendo ficused more on third parties during gamecubes lifetime and we got classics such as f-zero fx and others.

With all these rumours about Goldeneye possibly appearing on the Xbox 360, it got me thinking about what it would be like now on the Wii if RARE had not left Nintendo.

Would we have seen a few early Rare N64 titles on the VC from day one?

Would we have gotten something as a launch title? Perfect Dark, Viva Pinata or would Rare have just given us a mini-game collection perhaps? Conker's Bad Fur Day with Wii-controls and as the console's first online game would have been pretty cool methinks.

Characters such as Banjo Kazooie and Conker may be appearing in Smash Brothers Brawl. :awesome:

.


but These characters never appeared in Melee and as far as i remember rare were still intact then.. Nah i don't think so

[Caris]

I always wished Rare stayed with Nintendo.

[Ten10]

The Donkey Kong racing game for the wii wouldn't suck, like a fly chewing on turd.

[Emasher]

I thought their games were getting pretty bad just before the buy out.

But it would be cool to have their N64 games on the Virtual Console.

[david.dakota]

Nintendo must have been very pleased they got rid of Rare, it certainly paid their fine from the EC.

[mcj metroid]

The Donkey Kong racing game for the wii wouldn't suck, like a fly chewing on turd.

It would and does.. Honeslty ive played it it's shit:)

and i don't think rare making it would make it any better... grabbed by the ghoulies and starfox adventures should show you the that the team was going to shit before it left and after it did.

[Colin]

The Donkey Kong racing game for the wii wouldn't suck, like a fly chewing on turd.
I got the chance to see quite a little bit of art from Rare's DK racer for the cube, as my lecturer was working on it. Shame it never came through.

Only Rare game I really care about is Jet Force Gemini tbh. Give me that on Live Arcade or make a new gen version and I'd be over the moon.

[tapedeck]

Ever since the NES, Rare made some of my favourite games. I was extremely dissapointed when they left the Nintendo camp. It also seemed like a death knell for mainstream UK developers being put in the mindset of American and Japanese gamers. (My personal thoughts there.)

They really pushed the N64, as they did with all of the consoles they worked on. They even reverse-engineered the NES just to show Nintendo what they could do on it. That's close to genius in my eyes.
And in the mid 90's when they bought SGI workstations (for thousands) and went on to produce the Donkey Kong series AND Killer Instinct series on the SNES, showed a business sense (and understanding) not really seen these days. The Stamper brothers and there team at Twycross will always hold a special place in my heart.

Furthermore:

Rare seemed to have a vast understanding of what "fun" was about and coupled with their savvy technological understandings they not only cranked out gorgeous looking games, yet also made many different (high quality) genres of games too. Some of which were genre defining like Blast Corps. Producing memorable atmospheres and characters (and mechanics) in genres such as racers, fighters, platformers and first person shooters in ONE generation is something only really Nintendo seem to do, if at all.

I really feel that by the end of the N64's lifecycle they had burnt-out and were really trying to push the system too far. Perfect Dark had some flawed moments as did Conker and Banjo Tooie. (Mainly framerate issues). But with their vast understanding of what makes a "game" they always pulled a certain "magic" moment out of their cap. Something akin to Nintendo themselves.

I'll always miss Rare on Nintendo home consoles, yet the people are what made the business. And at one time in history I would say they had the most astoundingly talented, hard-working, passionate gamers working for them.
And now they've moved on. I guess it's like the Beatles (or____________insert favourite group here) they all split up and led their own lives but what they created at that moment in time was something tangible, something magical. And morseo, something that will live on in many a gamers hearts forever.

Personally, I wish the Stamper brothers (and Rare) all the best.

[Retro_Link]

They certainly aren't the company they once were (the SNES/N64 days we all knew and loved), both in terms of quality, but more importantly staff.

I do think though that of all the next gen console, Banjo Kazooie 3 would sell best on Wii.

[Sheikah]

What a travesty the loss of RARE was. Never have I seen a company go from in their element to absolute **** so quickly.

I mean, they were making nearly everything absolutely astounding on the N64! Ok maybe not near everything, but a significant proportion indeed. Then on the 360...Perfect Dark Zero...that conker remake...Cameo... ;-(

If they'd stayed with Nintendo...maybe new Banjo Kazooie games, a Goldeneye sequel, a better PD. For some reason I felt like they were forced to change their image when they switched, or something was broken up. I remember on the N64 they sometimes used to put eyes on top of inanimate objects which is just an example of their style.

What a waste :(

[Hero-of-Time]

To be fair I still rate Kameo as one of my favourite 360 games. The gameplay and graphics are amazing and the soundtrack is fantastic.

[flameboy]

Not much difference to their situation with Microsoft now...all the talent has left and gone elsewhere so its hardly a surprise that most of their games have been cack for awhile. Kameo gets away with it cos it was indevelopment for ages so likely had better people working on it.

[Zechs Merquise]

I wish Rare were still with Nintendo, I don;t feel their out put would have slumped so quickly if they had been either.

I think Rare and Nintendo were just a partnership that were meant to be, and they don;t work as well with Microsoft as they did with Nintendo.

Don;t get me wrong, other things hurt them like the loss of the Free Radical team, and I believe the Stamper brothers have now left as well. Things should have been different though,

[RossK]

a conker game where using the wii remote can erhum control conkers "wii" attack flow.:indeed:

[Patch]

I mean, they were making nearly everything absolutely astounding on the N64! Ok maybe not near everything, but a significant proportion indeed. Then on the 360...Perfect Dark Zero...that conker remake...Cameo... ;-(

Those are decent games by all accounts. They're not a bad developer by any stretch of the imagination. But they are a far cry from the legendary games we saw in the N64 generation. In my opinion, they are the only developer that has come close to taking Nintendo's crown.

I have difficulty picking my favourite Rare game. It's a tie between Blast Corps, Goldeneye and Perfect Dark.

[killthenet]

They'd still be called Rareware and the Stamper's would most likely still be in charge. Their below par games may well have been altered slightly before release and they could have a new Donkey Kong in the works.

[Fierce_LiNk]

Hmm, I think all this talk about Nintendo only catering for the casuals would stop. I would still have loved to have seen what PD: Zero would have looked like on a Nintendo console.

I dunno, since they left, I just haven't cared about a single thing they've done, and nothing strikes me like "ooo, I must play that, its RARE." I think they've kinda lost that brand appeal that they had when they were part of Nintendo.

[killthenet]

I get what you mean in regards to most of their output, but Viva Pinata! looks like classic Rare to me. They're taking a Nintendo concept as a basis and adding their own style to it, certainly sounds like a winner to me, though I'm yet to try it out due to lack of a 360.

Also, It's Mr Pants! was a fantastic (and funny) puzzle game, which was also released after their departure from Nintendo.

[The-chosen-one]

i wished they stayed , because then we would have seen a killer instinct game back for the wii bu now it would never happen because Rare owned 50% of that game the other 50 where from nintendo including the Name of killer instinct characters except for Fulgore and Sabrewulf eyedoll Gargos and music they where rare's and cinder was a property of Midway the rest was all property of Nintendo from story till the rest of the characters stages


and i would like to see a perfect dark on a nintendo console again because the 360 version sucked really bad

[Fierce_LiNk]

I haven't heard of It's Mr Pants, but I'm only semi-interested in Viva Pinata. It was mainly the perfect dark title I was most looking forward to, and I still have yet to play it, despite being a little disappointed to hear that it didn't turn out all that fantastic after all.

I'm glad that so many people love Viva, but it wasn't the title I was looking for from RARE.

[triforce_keeper]

I hope you don't mean just the N64 era MCJ...

The Donkey Kong games on the SNES were amazing, they are up there with OOT for me :)

[darksnowman]

Ideally, if Rare hadn't left, we would have seen Kameo, Conker, Perfect Dark... Donkey Kong Racing!! and some new things on the GameCube, and we would now have Perfect Dark on the Wii with some amazing controls.

Nintendo did right to sell them though. Sad but true.

[Ten10]

It would and does.. Honeslty ive played it it's shit:)

and i don't think rare making it would make it any better... grabbed by the ghoulies and starfox adventures should show you the that the team was going to shit before it left and after it did.

But wasn't starfox adventures not supposed to be starfox adventures? Maybe Nintendo were surpressing some of the creative flow. But even now they are still looking to develop for nintendo platforms and Microsoft seem to be saying Meh, it makes money.

[mcj metroid]

But wasn't starfox adventures not supposed to be starfox adventures? Maybe Nintendo were surpressing some of the creative flow. But even now they are still looking to develop for nintendo platforms and Microsoft seem to be saying Meh, it makes money.

but the only fun parts of starfox adventures were the arwing battles.. the rest of the game was pure....boring.

I hope you don't mean just the N64 era MCJ...

The Donkey Kong games on the SNES were amazing, they are up there with OOT for me :)

yes even going back to the nes they were fantastic.. Their port of donkey kong country on gb was brilliant.

[Kurtle Squad]

It'd be the same. Except:

Rare characters would be in Smash Bros.

Nintendo would have the one good game they've made in years, Viva Pinata.

I believe the Stamper brothers have now left as well. Things should have been different though,
Yeah; they did. So now it's not really Rare at all, but simply a load of franchises owned by a faceless company

[Sheikah]

It'd be the same. Except:

Rare characters would be in Smash Bros.

Nintendo would have the one good game they've made in years, Viva Pinata.


You're kidding? Considering RARE made most of the good games on the N64 no doubt they would have stuck to the same formula and would've made more quality games. Unless something else would have inevitably broken them up to the point of no return anyway.

Those are decent games by all accounts. They're not a bad developer by any stretch of the imagination. But they are a far cry from the legendary games we saw in the N64 generation. In my opinion, they are the only developer that has come close to taking Nintendo's crown.

I have difficulty picking my favourite Rare game. It's a tie between Blast Corps, Goldeneye and Perfect Dark.

All bog standard games in my opinion; definitely not something to write home about. Except maybe Viva Pinata by the sounds of it, but I've never played it.

[DCK]

It wouldn't be the same. We would've had PD:Zero, Kameo and Grabbed by the Ghoulies on GameCube or Wii, which would have made a nice addition. Perfect Dark and GoldenEye, and other Rare games would've been on VC. There would've been a decent DK racing game. Banjo-Threeie would be a Wii game. Star Fox Assault would've never happened.

On the other hand, Rare's presence may have withheld the creation of Nintendo Tokyo for DK: Jungle Beat, and may have cost us Mario Galaxy to some extent.

All in all, it's a pity Rare has left. I can't help but think they are losing their quality under Microsoft's supervision, and would've given us more reasonable quality games.

[Aimless]

To be fair I still rate Kameo as one of my favourite 360 games. The gameplay and graphics are amazing and the soundtrack is fantastic.
Ironically the early GameCube version (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FjOzZkkBThg) looked loads better to me. Not in the shininess stacks, but in the all important 'this is a free roaming game where you can turn into an iguana-type-thing and climb up mountains' aspect.

Similarly, Dinosaur Planet looked far more interesting when it was an N64 game (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f20Ck6tNnS4) sans the Starfox cast. Sure it was essentially just another Zelda game albeit made by Rare, but Fox and co taking starring roles was one of the most incongruous things with the eventual GameCube game.

At any rate, for me Rare lost their magic — and most likely their best staff — somewhere between the death of the Nintendo 64 and the life of the GameCube. I still hold out a glimmer of hope that the company will be able to mimic what it once was, but from where I'm sitting Nintendo made an excellent choice in loosing them when they did.

Oh, I did quite like Grabbed by the Ghoulies, though. Not a classic by any means, but definitely underrated by most.

[will']

There wouldn't really be that much difference at all. Instead of a few crap XBox/360 games there'd be a few crap Cube/Wii games.

[blender]

the more interesting question would be who would microsoft have bought instead of RARE ?
sega? ea? nintendo ?

[c0Zm1c]

Microsoft tried to buy Nintendo, for a reported $25 billion if memory serves.

[flameboy]

Microsoft tried to buy Nintendo, for a reported $25 billion if memory serves.

not sure if your figures are right but there were rumours flying around, but I think it BS to be honest, like the Nintendo and Apple merging that went around before Gamecube.

[c0Zm1c]

I think it was real, namely because I read a Yamauchi interview where he talked about what happened with the attempted buyout. It was quite an amusing read really. :smile:

EDIT: just looked for it and discovered it was fake! :indeed: Still, it's not the only place I've read about the supposed buyout.

[Jimbob]

On X-Box, Rare havn't been much good. Grabbed by the Goulies didn't grab me as such. Now on the 360, PDZ, Kameo and Viva are all great games. PDZ does have a few flaws, but Kameo and Viva make up for this game. I think this generation, we may see Rare flourish into something similar to what we saw on the N64.

If Rare had stayed with Ninty, and with the patience of Ninty as well, Rare may have made Goulies more fun and enjoyable and Kameo and DK racing would have been as we saw them back in 01/02. Maybe BK and PD would be readily available for the VC as we speak.

[philcollins]

oh man this is a sad thread : (
ive still got all my old rare games on n64. they made the n64, without them nintendo would of been on their arse. its kind of a shame nintendo had to stab them in the back and sell them off but after their weak recent performance i can see why.. i think they started to go downhill with banjo tooie.. that game was fairly 'magic free' and kind of a chore to play i hope threeie is the game that brings them back to form. its hard to say if its likely though since they seem like arrogant arseholes unable to admit their mistakes... also perfect dark zero should of been a hit that a monkey couldnt screw up, but they managed to screw it up after about a 10 yr development cycle..

i still play banjo and diddy king racing, which makes it even sadder to see whats become of them..

[Cube]

i think they started to go downhill with banjo tooie..

Banjo Tooie is my third favourite N64 game, just below Perfect Dark and Banjo Kazooie.

also perfect dark zero should of been a hit that a monkey couldnt screw up, but they managed to screw it up after about a 10 yr development cycle..

To be fair, the Perfect Dark team left Rare not long into that cycle...

[Maiky-NiSuTe]

if rare had not left Nintendo the games would be loads better and the main and best personnel would not have left Rare and free radical, ubisoft and n-soft would have less great personnel to go with. We would have a way better star fox adventure because the good guys would not have left it in ruble like they did. games like DK country, Banjo kameo and conker would also be better than the versions we saw after the take over. (not in visual context but more in quality)

in the end Microsoft only bought the name and rights from rare and that is it. most talented guys there left as soon as they eared of Nintendo's plans (the birth of free radical a few years before the take over)

[McPhee]

Kameo was good, as was Viva Piñata. I think they just went through a bad patch to be honest, the real test will be how good Banjo turns out to be.

Some people need to get they're facts straight with Rare though. The company began to leak vital staff members in 1997, with the departure of Oliver Davies, Oliver Norton, Steve Patrick, Jeff Stafford, Christopher Gage, and Adrian Smith. These staff members formed the developer Eighth Wonder, who were then bought up by SCEE. Then in 1998 Martin Hollis left left and started Zoonami, with the Free Radical team departing soon after.

It was under Nintendo that Rare lost most of it's talent (im not saying it was Nintendo's fault before anyone flames me). Microsoft didn't buy Rare until 2002, when they purchased the Stamper Brothers 51% share (making Microsoft the controlling share holder of Rare). This left Nintendo with a choice, either they kept they're 49% share and worked with Rare and Microsoft in future projects, or sell they're share to someone else. In the end they sold they're 49% to Microsoft, making them the sole owner of Rare. Rare kept every franchise they made, bar the ones relating to Nintendo characters.

Some people in this topic seem determined to remember Rare in a perfect light, and blame Microsoft for the mediocre games the company made between 2000 and 2006. This isn't the case, the company was in this shit when they were sold. Since then they've improved, slowly.

[mcj metroid]

the more interesting question would be who would microsoft have bought instead of RARE ?
sega? ea? nintendo ?

don't be stupid do you really think microsoft can just walk into a room and point which company they want like a child in a sweet shop?

NO they can't.. they tried to buy sega first and they refused and THEN they went after nintendo.. But failed again.